I can’t see why there should be a problem.   What sort of work and what is your procedure?

Hello Greensands,

Have a look at the ARC “versatile” milling vices.  Very pleased with my 100mm version.  Pity I had to buy it with a swivel base (removable) that I’m unlikely to use in the future.

First we need to understand the issue.

If the OP means two sides square, ie, perpendicular, then the base of the vice is irrelvant. Squareness is set by the relationship between the fixed jaw and the machine axes. If, however, the OP means two opposite sides parallel then the vice base does indeed have an effect.

I have a large (by ME standards) high end industrial machine vice. The width of the ways is about 6″ but it is still hit and miss to get two sides parallel to a thou or so. If I really need parallel sides then I prefer to clamp the work direct to the milling machine table.

My original machine vice looks very similar to that shown by the OP, but has no name and is much larger. It had nearly 20 thou of jaw lift, which made life un-necessarily complicated. Which is one reason I bought the aforementioned high end machine vice.

Personally I wouldn’t give workshop room to wavy parallels.

Andrew

My preference and suggestion would be for the Arc Precision vice over the versatile.

Ian P

Oops, I should have said Type 3

Ian P

https://youtu.be/9c76g_CBr88

Her is the link to part 1 of 2 video’s.

Steve.

On 8 April 2024 at 07:08 JasonB Said:

The Versatile and iron versions although having the wider ways which make them better for supporting a parallel or longer work do have the disadvantage when working on shorter parts of not having any support in the middle so you can’t stand work on the bottom and have to raise it up meaning more stick out and less to grip.

 

Six of one half a dozen of the other. But I still prefer the Versatile over a precision type.

 

I do use wavy parallels but only on work that is thinner than one of my usual solid parallels so the jaws can be close up onto the work. Otherwise it is one or two solid parallels.

Did you try (a Type 3) precision vice to arrive at that preference Jason?

The choice of vice for every person depends on a multiplicity of factors, but based on the fact that this forum is aimed at mostly home workshop and modelling its does sort of define the probable physical size of suitable vices to, say, between 50mm and 100mm jaw width. Low profile is generally important too.

For me the best feature of the Type 3 is the total lack of jaw lift combined with the fact that every external surface is a precision reference. Setting parts in the jaws is highly repeatable.

Slight qualification to the jaw lift statement. My vice did not come from Arc (but it looks identical) and after 10 years of hard use I cannot detect ANY play in the moving jaw, however Arc’s description states,

“The moveable jaw is held down with a keep plate and two screws. The screws are not locked tight but are used to adjust out jaw lift”

I wonder if this is an error and the screws can be locked tight? (I have sent a message to ask Arc).

Ian P

Greensands, years ago I lusted after an Abwood vice and bought a 3″ the same size as yours, it was a lovely tool and I had no real problem with the short centre section but the limited jaw opening was very very frustrating! I ‘upgraded’ to a 4″ Arc versatile vice [blue painted as Jason B photo above], not the best quality and I had to get the 2 hard jaws surface ground from new as they were tapered but I love it, some much capacity!!!

Tony

The ARC versatile 5″, 125mm which I bought has had the rear flange cut off to give a bit more Y movement on the mills. When I bought it, I might have gone for the better SG iron ones, but the smaller didn’t open far enough and the larger was really too big to fit comfortably on the mill bed, which is the largest bed fitted on a round column mill with 500mm X axis movement.

If you are really concerned about max jaw opening how about a two piece?, your parts would mostly be on the table as well (more headroom).

For overhang of long components being machined I always use a pair of parallels out board of the vice, and tap down over the parallels! But one of the essentials with a vice is to ‘service’ it to minimise the jaw wobble and lift, check thos gib strips and adjust them with the screw removed to get the moving jaw to slide smoothly with minimum binding. One of my vices is a 4″ Abwood and I always get work seated with the minimum amount of faffing. I always clean it scrupulously on the underside as well as the mill bed (after occasional using a ‘flatting stone’ on the table) before clamping it down. Then I run a 1/10 thou clock to align the fixed jaw and also run it across the bed of the vice to check parallelism to the table.

A trick I learnt as an apprentice was to use a sheet of folded newspaper trapped between the moving jaw and the component being gripped, this was an aid to preventing the job ‘bouncing up’ when tapped down. For a tapping hammer I also always use a lead hammer. The ‘tap’ needs to be just that, not a blow.

As for vices I seem to have collected a variety over the years, these include a 4″ Abwood (as previously stated), a 4″ Edgwick (identical to the Abwood), a 4″ Palmgren (USA made), a 4″ Aciera on a swivel base, another 4″ Abwood on a swivel and tilt base (a brilliant vice for some jobs but with a resultant reduction in headroom). I also have some 3″ vices, which are of unknown origins but are likely to be British or at least European – one possibly a Schuablin. All are likely to be 50+ years old but where necessary they have been reconditioned to clean up ways and new jaws fitted, bases skimmed if any dings were present, drill holes filled with Metalux Cold casting iron epoxy (to the extent that they are visually perfect!). Part of the fun of machining is getting to know the quirks of your tools and finding the best ways to correct any known problems.

If I had to choose any of my vices as a keeper then it would probably be the Abwood or the Edgwick (which I picked up at a junk shop for £15 in a very sorry state – but it did come with the original handle), closely followed by the Aciera which is beautifully made and is really ‘low slung’.

Martin