Why don’t we make models of things like this?

Advert

New Replies

Report Bug

Help/FAQs

Why don’t we make models of things like this?

This topic has 60 replies, 27 voices, and was last updated 9 March 2017 at 22:15 by Allan B.

Viewing 25 posts - 1 through 25 (of 61 total)

1 2 3 →

Author

Posts
5 March 2017 at 21:44 #287314
Neil Wyatt
Moderator
@neilwyatt
I just turned up this on Wikipedia:

An electric motor with as much character as a steam engine? More character than a totally enclosed uniflow steam engine!

So why don't we (generally) see models of things like this?

What other oddities do people think would make good models?

Neil
Advert

5 March 2017 at 21:44 #4268
Neil Wyatt
Moderator
@neilwyatt
5 March 2017 at 22:23 #287320
John Haine
Participant
@johnhaine32865
Cos it's electrickery…..
5 March 2017 at 22:33 #287323
Phil P
Participant
@philp
We do make stuff like that.

And its going to be driven by a Uniflow engine.

This model was started by the late Arnold Throp in the 1940's, and has been passed through various owners before ending up with me.

I will hopefully be finishing it and displaying it at some point when I have finished my model of "Agnes"

Phil
5 March 2017 at 22:34 #287325
Allan B
Participant
@allanb
Would be cool to make, I think it’s just because there are more plans for steam available
5 March 2017 at 22:52 #287328
Andy Ash
Participant
@andyash24902
Very similar to your synchronous motor would be the Alexanderson alternators they used to generate high power VLF (long wave) transmissions in the early days of radio.

They didn't have thermionic valves big enough to use as oscillators, so they did it mechanically instead!
5 March 2017 at 22:55 #287329
Georgineer
Participant
@georgineer
After I've built the Boy's Own Model Gas Engine of 1895 (detailed design still a work-in-progress) I plan to build the boy's Own Small Generator of 1891, then link the two together.

Does that count?

George

Edited By Georgineer on 05/03/2017 22:56:16
5 March 2017 at 23:08 #287334
JA
Participant
@ja
Andy

Didn't they try send voice/music using such things before valves (triodes) arrived?

General

As for modelling such an item, it is not sexy unlike a steam engine or locomotive. I can just about understand those who want to make a 1/4 scale model of a Dean, Smith & Grace lathe (like the one I walk passed three or four times a week) but if I made a scale model of an RB211-22B would anyone be interested? [One: It would not work. Two: I would not even try].

JA
5 March 2017 at 23:29 #287336
Andy Ash
Participant
@andyash24902
Radio transmission was one of the things that Tesla was messing around with.

I'd bet he tried all sorts of stuff.

Generally though I think the early VLF transmission were probably morse code.

If you have high power CW transmitter you can modulate it with a broomstick and some drawing pins!!!
6 March 2017 at 06:01 #287348
Doug Bauld
Participant
@dougbauld76775
Neil does have a very good point, I for one will not Knock It. Just try winding the coils by hand and laying them for correct connection to the commutator ?
6 March 2017 at 07:08 #287350
Neil Wyatt
Moderator
@neilwyatt
Posted by Phil P on 05/03/2017 22:33:00:

We do make stuff like that.

And its going to be driven by a Uniflow engine.

This model was started by the late Arnold Throp in the 1940's, and has been passed through various owners before ending up with me.

I will hopefully be finishing it and displaying it at some point when I have finished my model of "Agnes"

Phil

Excellent Phil -the exception that proves the rule! Although the fact it's still unfinished sixty years on says a lot too!

Please document the build and then share it with Diane for ME!

Neil
6 March 2017 at 07:10 #287351
Neil Wyatt
Moderator
@neilwyatt
Posted by Georgineer on 05/03/2017 22:55:09:

After I've built the Boy's Own Model Gas Engine of 1895 (detailed design still a work-in-progress) I plan to build the boy's Own Small Generator of 1891, then link the two together.

Does that count?

George

Edited By Georgineer on 05/03/2017 22:56:16

Yep!

Parents must have been very understanding in 1891 to let boys attach handwheels to 'Dining Room Table T'.

Neil
6 March 2017 at 07:40 #287353
JasonB
Moderator
@jasonb
Neil, generators are very popular on the other side of the channel, the Germans seem to be very keen on them be they driven by steam or IC engines

Quite a nice build of one here, note the unusual use of alphabeti spagetti. The German ME supplies also sell quite a few generator kits

And closer to home over on MEM there is someone making up a generator to be driven by an Alyn Foundry Retlas engine. You may also be interested in the Franklin Engine there too.

J
6 March 2017 at 09:10 #287376
richardandtracy
Participant
@richardandtracy
Posted by Neil Wyatt on 05/03/2017 21:44:12:

…So why don't we (generally) see models of things like this?…

Because steam seems to take on a character of its own when working. Electrical stuff looks identical whether live, not running or dead as a Dodo. It has all the charm & attraction of a brick or transistor or a smack in the face.

Regards,

Richard.
6 March 2017 at 09:19 #287380
JA
Participant
@ja
I went to sleep thinking about Neil's last question – What other oddities do people think would make good models?

Obviously the model must be seen to do something and if possible its working parts be seen to move. Most types of steam engine have been done to death but two engines come to mind. One is the early paddle steamer engine (I know there are plans for some out there, perhaps even castings). The other would be an Easton, Amos & Sons drainage machine. There is a fine working machine not too far from me and I have spent quite a few days, when the workshop has been too cold, trying to make drawings for a model. I realise now that I will never start cutting metal for it.
6 March 2017 at 10:19 #287390
Ian S C
Participant
@iansc
Volume one of "The Model Engineer and Amateur Electrician" (note the original name), has plans for a number of electric motors / generators.

Ian S C
6 March 2017 at 10:45 #287396
JasonB
Moderator
@jasonb
JA, I know someone who also has desires to make a model of the engine at Westonzoylands too, I did take quite a few photos of the ones that were at Prestons for them.
6 March 2017 at 11:08 #287402
Harry Wilkes
Participant
@harrywilkes58467
Posted by Neil Wyatt on 05/03/2017 21:44:12:

I just turned up this on Wikipedia:

An electric motor with as much character as a steam engine? More character than a totally enclosed uniflow steam engine!

So why don't we (generally) see models of things like this?

What other oddities do people think would make good models?

Neil

Don't make them Neil but I've serviced one or two of them and their bigger cousins with brushes like house bricks

H
6 March 2017 at 11:42 #287415
Russell Eberhardt
Participant
@russelleberhardt48058
In the future will people make scale models of microprocessors?

Does quantum theory scale?

Russell
6 March 2017 at 11:53 #287421
Neil Wyatt
Moderator
@neilwyatt
Posted by JasonB on 06/03/2017 07:40:23:

Neil, generators are very popular on the other side of the channel, the Germans seem to be very keen on them be they driven by steam or IC engines

Quite a nice build of one here, note the unusual use of alphabeti spagetti. The German ME supplies also sell quite a few generator kits

And closer to home over on MEM there is someone making up a generator to be driven by an Alyn Foundry Retlas engine. You may also be interested in the Franklin Engine there too.

J

Wow! That makes me even more perplexed that UK modellers don't choose these as a subject! The usual UK approach is to stuff a permanent magnet motor in a decorative shell.

Are those kits of castings or just screw together kits? I clicked the Union Flag but nothing happens – I can scratch by in French but German is beyond me.

Neil

Edited By Neil Wyatt on 06/03/2017 11:57:49
6 March 2017 at 11:54 #287423
Neil Wyatt
Moderator
@neilwyatt
Posted by richardandtracy on 06/03/2017 09:10:14:

Posted by Neil Wyatt on 05/03/2017 21:44:12:

…So why don't we (generally) see models of things like this?…

Because steam seems to take on a character of its own when working. Electrical stuff looks identical whether live, not running or dead as a Dodo. It has all the charm & attraction of a brick or transistor or a smack in the face.

I can't agree, I think an open-frame generator has at least as much interest as something like a Stuart Sirius.

Neil
6 March 2017 at 11:54 #287424
Neil Wyatt
Moderator
@neilwyatt
I have gathered quite a lot of information on steam hammers, one day…

Neil
6 March 2017 at 12:00 #287425
Hopper
Participant
@hopper
Posted by Neil Wyatt on 05/03/2017 21:44:12:

So why don't we (generally) see models of things like this?

Same reason that stone-aged technology V-twin motorcycles outsell the latest hi-tech four cylinder jobbies. One just sits there and very efficiently spins away flawlessly while the other one goes chuffa chuffa chuffa and jumps up and down. Something to do with resonating with the human heartbeat, taking us back to the womb etc etc. So I'm told…

Edited By Hopper on 06/03/2017 12:01:17
6 March 2017 at 12:03 #287427
Dave Daniels
Participant
@davedaniels93256
I have a fair interest in this sort of thing:

http://www.sparkmuseum.com/MOTORS.HTM

One of the stoppers ( ? ) is the difficulty of getting Silicon Iron laminations or Soft Iron.

Tried some years ago but got nowhere.

One educational supplies site actually listed 3/8" soft iron rods but were actually mild steel when quizzed.

Unless someone knows where the stuff can be obtained in smallish quantities.

D.
6 March 2017 at 12:27 #287433
paul rushmer
Participant
@paulrushmer83015
Hi Dave

About 25 years ago I bought some soft iron from my local transformer winding company approx. 1mm thick 60mm wide another sauce is old welding sets or spot welders.

Hope this helps Paul
Author

Posts