Advice Wanted – On obtaining help…

Advert

Advice Wanted – On obtaining help…

Home Forums Help and Assistance! (Offered or Wanted) Advice Wanted – On obtaining help…

Viewing 25 posts - 1 through 25 (of 26 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #660004
    Andy_H
    Participant
      @andy_h

      I hope if put this post in the right place – it seems the most appropriate forum to me.

      I need a replacement component made for an old small (12"&nbsp lathe. It's a new mandrel with a different nose thread). So it's a small component but includes a small section of screw cutting and internal morse taper, which I am unable to do with the facilities (and expertise) I have.

      I'm looking for some advice on whether there is an "accepted" (or recommended) way of finding out if it's the sort of thing someone would be prepared to help with. Or, indeed whether it's a job that's too big (in complexity rather than size terms!) to expect help with.

      I'm also going to do a bit of googling to see if I come up with any suitable commercial services that aren't prohibitively expensive but thought it would be worth asking here as well.

      Andy

      Edited By Andy_H on 13/09/2023 16:33:13

      Advert
      #34269
      Andy_H
      Participant
        @andy_h
        #660006
        Oldiron
        Participant
          @oldiron

          Hi. A little more info would be helpful in getting the correct advise. Make & model of lathe ( a picture speaks a thousand words) A few dimensions. Your approx' location.

          As much info as you have make things much easier.

          regards

          #660010
          ega
          Participant
            @ega

            Further to Oldiron's point, by 12" do you mean of 12" centre height or 6" ditto? Neither would be a small lathe in a hobbyist's book.

            Or is it 12" between centres?

            #660024
            Andy_H
            Participant
              @andy_h
              Posted by ega on 13/09/2023 17:12:22:

              Further to Oldiron's point, by 12" do you mean of 12" centre height or 6" ditto? Neither would be a small lathe in a hobbyist's book.

              Or is it 12" between centres?

              Ah, I entirely see your point and of course the unintentional ambiguity in my post. Apologies.

              So, the lathe (a Flexispeed) is 12" between centres. The part I want to replace (the mandrel) is about 5" long and would be produced from 0.75" diameter steel.

              I would, of course, expect to produce a proper drawing. But I think another point I perhaps failed to explain in my original posting was I am not ready with all the precise details yet (I am working on that) but was instead simply trying to gague whether this is it's the sort of thing that would be deemed acceptable to seek help with or, to be put it bluntly, be looked upon as a damned cheek!

              Andy

              #660029
              Emgee
              Participant
                @emgee

                Andy

                When completed put a picture of your drawing in your Photo album and perhaps some kind person may be able to help you.

                Emgee

                #660062
                Oldiron
                Participant
                  @oldiron

                  I presume by "mandrel" you mean what would normally be called the "Spindle"

                  Somewhat similar to this link. Spindle

                  regards

                  #660064
                  duncan webster 1
                  Participant
                    @duncanwebster1

                    The Flexispeed is a remote ancestor of the Cowells. Bit of a long shot, but the spindle might fit, and Mr Cowells will sell you one.

                    #660086
                    Andy_H
                    Participant
                      @andy_h
                      Posted by Oldiron on 14/09/2023 11:36:00:

                      I presume by "mandrel" you mean what would normally be called the "Spindle"

                      Somewhat similar to this link. Spindle

                      regards

                      Yes I do.

                      In fact I have always referred to it as a spindle but having seen it referred to in several other posts as a mandrel used it here.

                      Your question got my curiosity working though wondering how the two terms differ which led me to this definition:

                      a usually tapered or cylindrical axle, spindle, or arbor inserted into a hole in a piece of work to support it during machining

                      So my take on this is that, although a mandrel can be a spindle, the distinction is that it's something used with a workpiece, whereas I was referring to the machine not a workpiece – so should have used the term spindle!

                      Andy

                      #660088
                      Oldiron
                      Participant
                        @oldiron
                        Posted by Andy_H on 14/09/2023 15:11:28:

                        Posted by Oldiron on 14/09/2023 11:36:00:

                        I presume by "mandrel" you mean what would normally be called the "Spindle"

                        Somewhat similar to this link. Spindle

                        regards

                        Yes I do.

                        In fact I have always referred to it as a spindle but having seen it referred to in several other posts as a mandrel used it here.

                        Your question got my curiosity working though wondering how the two terms differ which led me to this definition:

                        a usually tapered or cylindrical axle, spindle, or arbor inserted into a hole in a piece of work to support it during machining

                        So my take on this is that, although a mandrel can be a spindle, the distinction is that it's something used with a workpiece, whereas I was referring to the machine not a workpiece – so should have used the term spindle!

                        Andy

                        yes

                        #660123
                        Andy_H
                        Participant
                          @andy_h
                          Posted by duncan webster on 14/09/2023 11:47:33:

                          The Flexispeed is a remote ancestor of the Cowells. Bit of a long shot, but the spindle might fit, and Mr Cowells will sell you one.

                          A good suggestion thanks.

                          I've already made the enquiry today and already have an answer. Although both are 0.5" it is not a suitable replacement. Although at the price I'm rather relieved it's not an option!

                          Andy

                          #660129
                          David-Clark 1
                          Participant
                            @david-clark1

                            A friend of mine is going to make me a mandrel for a Super Adept. Like yours but 3/8 shaft rather than 1/2 inch. I am using a Unimat nose thread, m14 x 1.

                            Not a big job at all.

                            I too replaced a Cowell's mandrel many years ago, it cost about £110 back then, probably 20 years ago.

                            The only reason I am not turning it now is because I don’t have another lathe to do it on.

                            If you want an imperial thread on it, you could turn a new mandrel between centres on the Cowells and screwcutting it on the Cowell's itself. I don’t know if you can do a metric thread on a Cowell's but a 63-tooth change gear might help. (Approximately half of a 127-tooth gear.

                            #660153
                            Andy_H
                            Participant
                              @andy_h
                              Posted by David-Clark 1 on 14/09/2023 22:32:45:

                              A friend of mine is going to make me a mandrel for a Super Adept. Like yours but 3/8 shaft rather than 1/2 inch. I am using a Unimat nose thread, m14 x 1.

                              Not a big job at all.

                              I too replaced a Cowell's mandrel many years ago, it cost about £110 back then, probably 20 years ago.

                              The only reason I am not turning it now is because I don’t have another lathe to do it on.

                              If you want an imperial thread on it, you could turn a new mandrel between centres on the Cowells and screwcutting it on the Cowell's itself. I don’t know if you can do a metric thread on a Cowell's but a 63-tooth change gear might help. (Approximately half of a 127-tooth gear.

                              Hi David – perhaps not a big job providing you have the machine to produce it on wink

                              The Cowell's spindle is now £195 +VAT. Wow!

                              On your last point – I don't actually have a Cowell's lathe…. that only came into the thread as a suggested possible replacement for the Flexispeed part.

                              Andy

                              #660154
                              Andy_H
                              Participant
                                @andy_h
                                Posted by Emgee on 13/09/2023 23:15:30:

                                Andy

                                When completed put a picture of your drawing in your Photo album and perhaps some kind person may be able to help you.

                                Emgee

                                I have now produced a preliminary drawing.

                                I have also found a small company that claims to do small jobs at very competitive prices so I have requested a quote. I will see what comes of that.

                                Andy

                                lathespindle.jpg

                                #660433
                                David George 1
                                Participant
                                  @davidgeorge1

                                  Andy what is wrong with original spinde. Is it beyond repair or is it just the fit between the bearings and the spindle or is this a modification to original.

                                  David

                                  #660442
                                  Redsetter
                                  Participant
                                    @redsetter

                                    Andy,

                                    With respect, I think you will find that the Flexispeed is made to Imperial dimensions so you should stick with those, apart from your chosen nose thread.

                                    From your drawing, 12.8mm is a bit more than 1/2", so probably 1/2" bearings. 6.3mm is a bit less than 1/4", so probably 1/4" bore – you need to be a lot more precise than that! And what are you going to do about the worm gear?

                                    If you can find someone to do it, best to just let them have the whole machine and tell them what you want, so that they can fit the spindle to the job rather than trying to rely on a drawing.

                                    And it costs what it costs. It may not be difficult for a skilled person, but it will be time-consuming, so don't expect them to do it for beer money.

                                    £200 odd for the Cowells spindle isn't unreasonable, and an accurately made one-off, starting from scratch, will probably be be more than that.

                                    Sorry if this all sounds a bit negative, but I am not sure you are being realistic. As said- what is the actual problem with the existing spindle?

                                    #660448
                                    Andy_H
                                    Participant
                                      @andy_h
                                      Posted by David George 1 on 18/09/2023 07:16:08:

                                      Andy what is wrong with original spinde. Is it beyond repair or is it just the fit between the bearings and the spindle or is this a modification to original.

                                      David

                                      The reason for replacement is just to change the nose thread so as to make it possible to but replacement chuchs.

                                      Andy

                                      #660450
                                      Andy_H
                                      Participant
                                        @andy_h
                                        Posted by Redsetter on 18/09/2023 09:36:25:

                                        Andy,

                                        With respect, I think you will find that the Flexispeed is made to Imperial dimensions so you should stick with those, apart from your chosen nose thread.

                                        From your drawing, 12.8mm is a bit more than 1/2", so probably 1/2" bearings. 6.3mm is a bit less than 1/4", so probably 1/4" bore – you need to be a lot more precise than that! And what are you going to do about the worm gear?

                                        If you can find someone to do it, best to just let them have the whole machine and tell them what you want, so that they can fit the spindle to the job rather than trying to rely on a drawing.

                                        And it costs what it costs. It may not be difficult for a skilled person, but it will be time-consuming, so don't expect them to do it for beer money.

                                        £200 odd for the Cowells spindle isn't unreasonable, and an accurately made one-off, starting from scratch, will probably be be more than that.

                                        Sorry if this all sounds a bit negative, but I am not sure you are being realistic. As said- what is the actual problem with the existing spindle

                                        There's some valid points here but, in my defence the diagram IS clearly marked as preliminary and not for production purposes. It was provided simply to provide an indication of the size of the piece and key features (to clarify some points raised in an earlier reply). The drawing also proposes what to do about the worm, gear!

                                        As for the "beer money" point. Unfortunately, my post seems to have been misunderstood right from the outset. The purpose of the post was not originally asking for someone to offer to help (although someone has). It was instead seeking advice on how to go about requesting help and, more importantly, whether it this sort of job is considered too complex to expect anyone to help in the first place.

                                        I fully accept the point about imperial measurements. I would do that on a final version of the drawing intended for production.

                                        Andy

                                        #660451
                                        JasonB
                                        Moderator
                                          @jasonb

                                          I'd be inclined to have the bore a little over 1/4" so you can pass that diameter stock through it. 6.5mm would do and also avois a step where the small end of the taper meets the bore as MT0 is just over 1/4".

                                          You may also want to condider specifying a finish particularly for the bearing surfaces which may be better off ground than turned.

                                          Does the Flexispeed have bearing shells or does the spindle run directly in the Cast iron, if in the iron than again a little over 1/2" could be useful if the bearing surfaces have become worn that would allow them to be fitted to the new oversize spindle.

                                          #660455
                                          Redsetter
                                          Participant
                                            @redsetter

                                            If the object of the exercise is just to allow fitting of different chucks, then an easier solution might be to make an adaptor, or a few separate backplates. I had a Zyto branded Flexispeed long ago, and I think the nose thread was 1/2" BSF. If so, no problem getting a tap to start you off.

                                            #660456
                                            Pete White
                                            Participant
                                              @petewhite15172

                                              All this thought and planning just to be able to " possible to but replacement chuchs " ?

                                              Have you already got the replacement chucks and presumably other fitting, or will you have to source them?

                                              Is there any room to make an andapter, which you could do yourself on the lathe?

                                              We try to be a helpful forum solving peoples problems that often they don't have?

                                              My guess is that this "project" won't happen, but what do I know? But good luck with it Andy

                                              Pete

                                              Redsetter beat me to it, lol

                                               

                                              Edited By Pete White on 18/09/2023 11:50:50

                                              #660460
                                              Emgee
                                              Participant
                                                @emgee

                                                Andy

                                                I believe you need to have a better spec material than mild steel for a spindle, as a minimum EN8 but En16 or higher would be my choice.

                                                Emgee

                                                #660461
                                                Howard Lewis
                                                Participant
                                                  @howardlewis46836

                                                  If you want replacement chucks, why not make an adaptor?

                                                  I've made one to fit Myford 7 Series thread (1.125 x 12 tpi ) chucks to a Myford ML4.

                                                  Also, more recently, have modified a backplate to allow a modern 80 mm chuck (Intended for a mini lathe ) to be screwed onto a 3/4 x 10 tpi Whit form threaded mandrel on a much older lathe.

                                                  An adaptor might well be cheaper abd quisker than a complete new spindle.

                                                  Howard.

                                                  #660476
                                                  Andy_H
                                                  Participant
                                                    @andy_h
                                                    Posted by Howard Lewis on 18/09/2023 12:54:54:

                                                    If you want replacement chucks, why not make an adaptor?……

                                                    It seems my post has probably come across as, at best very naive and at worst careless and completely lacking any forethought!

                                                    In fact I've been pondering the problem for a few weeks and done quite a bit of research in various places, these forums included, where others have encountered the sample "problem" with exactly the same lathe (and its close cousins).

                                                    Many options have been considered by others (with lots of input from forum members). I obviously won't repeat all the options and the arguments for discounting them (including a spindle adapter) here but in summary there have been two solutions used by others that stand out:

                                                    1) Manufacture a new spindle.

                                                    2) Bore out the chuck and convert, and insert a bush threaded to suit the existing spindle (effectively an adapter in the chuck rather than on the spindle). Down side of this of course is it has to be repeated for each check or accessory to be mounted on the spindle.

                                                    and actually, none of these solutions is feasible without a usable chuck to hold the work in. That, you might say, is the chicken-and-egg situation I have here wink

                                                    Andy

                                                    #660478
                                                    JasonB
                                                    Moderator
                                                      @jasonb

                                                      If you go for a backplate fitting chuck then once the thread has been cut in the backplate which could be done with drill press and tap then the remaining machining is done in situe so does not need a chuck to hold the backplate. A backplate mount chuck also needs no modification. May lessen your chuck choice a bit in the smaller sizes which tend to more commonly come with a threaded body. What diameter chuck were you looking to fit?

                                                    Viewing 25 posts - 1 through 25 (of 26 total)
                                                    • Please log in to reply to this topic. Registering is free and easy using the links on the menu at the top of this page.

                                                    Advert

                                                    Latest Replies

                                                    Viewing 25 topics - 1 through 25 (of 25 total)
                                                    Viewing 25 topics - 1 through 25 (of 25 total)

                                                    View full reply list.

                                                    Advert

                                                    Newsletter Sign-up