Has anybody built the steam engine kit : (40701) Liegende 12/36 ?

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Has anybody built the steam engine kit : (40701) Liegende 12/36 ?

This topic has 143 replies, 13 voices, and was last updated 3 August 2016 at 08:11 by Brian John.

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23 October 2014 at 03:26 #3227
Brian John
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@brianjohn93961
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23 October 2014 at 03:26 #167443
Brian John
Participant
@brianjohn93961
It is available from the US and from France :

**LINK**

**LINK**

I quite like the Stephenson link on this one but I am not sure of the dimensions of the kit. If anybody has built it can you tell me the overall length and the diameter of the flywheel ? I do not think the wooden base is included in the basic kit.
23 October 2014 at 07:38 #167447
JasonB
Moderator
@jasonb
Both links say 90mm flywheel

Both links have an additional cost for the base.

Looks like you can also buy the parts to make it a twin.

As the flywheel is 90mm the engine would be in the region of 230mm and teh base 300mm

Edited By JasonB on 23/10/2014 07:39:51

Edited By JasonB on 23/10/2014 07:45:55
20 March 2015 at 05:41 #183844
Brian John
Participant
@brianjohn93961
I have purchased this kit and its wooden base. It arrived yesterday and I have unpacked it today. The engine parts look very well machined but I will have a fitting session to make sure everything goes together before painting the larger pieces.

1. The wooden base is NOT a solid block of wood : it is a wooden box that you glue together ! Had I known this , I would not have ordered the wooden base (40 Euros). The top piece does not quite cover up the slotted holes so I will have to work out a fix for that. Just a warning if anybody else is thinking of purchasing this kit.

2. I was informed prior to purchase that the instructions are all in German. I did not think this would be a problem but I am having my doubts now ; it would be nice to be able to read the instructions . Is there some way that I can scan the German instructions and have them translated into English using a website or computer program ?

Edited By Brian John on 20/03/2015 05:42:06

Edited By Brian John on 20/03/2015 05:42:45

Edited By Brian John on 20/03/2015 05:43:31
20 March 2015 at 07:44 #183854
Michael Gilligan
Participant
@michaelgilligan61133
Posted by Brian John on 20/03/2015 05:41:27:

2. I was informed prior to purchase that the instructions are all in German. I did not think this would be a problem but I am having my doubts now ; it would be nice to be able to read the instructions . Is there some way that I can scan the German instructions and have them translated into English using a website or computer program ?

.

Brian,

Assuming that you can already scan and OCR the German [or that you are happy to copy-type the words]; Google Translate is probably all you need.

MichaelG.
20 March 2015 at 07:52 #183855
John Olsen
Participant
@johnolsen79199
If you can scan the instructions you can fed them to something like Google translate…I used to have a scan program that was OK with German. If it is optimised for English it may not work so well. Otherwise if there is not too much you can retype…

Google translate

For 40 Euros I would expect a nice piece of decent timber with routed edges, nicely oiled. By decent timber I mean something like Oak, Walnut, Jarrah, or Kauri. I would love to do one for you at that sort of price, but the postage from NZ might make it a bit of a killer.

John
20 March 2015 at 08:03 #183858
JasonB
Moderator
@jasonb
The advantage of "box" construction is that you don't get any end grain showing. I make all my bases by mitering 4 bits of wood for the very same reason. Its also a more stable method of construction and allows you to run pipework under the base if needed which gives a neater installation a syou can have a discrete connection for air or steem on the back side of the base. a bit like this one of mine.

As Michael says scan it in with OCR and then use Google translate, not always good for technical terms but should give you the general idea.
20 March 2015 at 08:20 #183863
Michael Gilligan
Participant
@michaelgilligan61133
Posted by JasonB on 20/03/2015 08:03:07:

Google translate, not always good for technical terms

.

One good thing about technical German is that most of the complex words are actually concatenations of smaller, simpler, words … it's all very logical.

If Google Translate can't cope with a big word, try inserting odd spaces, or trimming-off characters. … It's fairly 'interactive'.

MichaelG.

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 20/03/2015 08:21:27
20 March 2015 at 17:35 #183925
Brian John
Participant
@brianjohn93961
John : yes, for that price I was expecting a nice solid bit of timber. That is why I paid 60 Euros for it ! As it is, the top does not even fit properly ; it should be about 4mm wider to cover the underlying slots.

Other than the timber plinth it should be a nice kit to build. Has anybody actually built one yet ….I can't be the first ?
21 March 2015 at 12:29 #184014
Brian John
Participant
@brianjohn93961
I have translated some bits and pieces of the instruction booklet on page one which are in red so I assume that they are important. It looks like the first page says to disregard the following pages in regards to the pistons ! The original idea was to twist some Teflon tape into a string and then wrap this around the piston to seal it. The first page says this is no longer necessary and to leave the pistons as they are. They are wrapped in what I thought was some sort of packaging but it looks like this is their version of a piston ring ? Why not use piston rings for goodness sake !

I am going to have to translate this whole document but typing it is very slow going. I have been to Officeworks today and they have scanned the instructions and put all 13 pages on a USB stick. Is there some way I can use Google Translate to translate the whole PDF file without me typing it ?

Edited By Brian John on 21/03/2015 12:29:37

Edited By Brian John on 21/03/2015 12:30:08
21 March 2015 at 13:15 #184019
JasonB
Moderator
@jasonb
Brian you need to get it scanned with an OCR program this will pick out the individual letters and words rather than treating the page as an image. You can then just copy and paste the text into a translator. If you don't have a home scanner e-mail me the PDF and I'll do it for you.

J
21 March 2015 at 13:39 #184023
Michael Gilligan
Participant
@michaelgilligan61133
Brian,

I think this might save you some effort.

MichaelG.
21 March 2015 at 17:14 #184050
Brian John
Participant
@brianjohn93961
Jason : I will try to email you the file.

Michael : Thank you, that translation is very useful. I think it may be the older version of the instructions but it is still useful. Why they didn't just use piston rings instead of mucking about with Teflon tape is beyond me…so much easier !
23 March 2015 at 06:29 #184210
Brian John
Participant
@brianjohn93961
Here are some photos of all the bit and pieces. I have tried to show the Teflon wrapping around the piston and the valve. I initially thought it was just protective wrapping to be cut away ! If the Sieg C0 lathes ever come back into the country again then I would love to make a proper piston and piston ring to replace this.
23 March 2015 at 11:17 #184224
Ian S C
Participant
@iansc
I think you'll find that the piston you have is pretty good, you just want a smooth bore for it, once it's bedded in it should last for ever (well a long time).

Ian S C
24 March 2015 at 07:01 #184288
Brian John
Participant
@brianjohn93961
I think the fit is a bit on the stiff side. If I had a piston without Teflon wrapping then I could put it in a drill and polish it down with some 2000 sandpaper. That is what I did with the PM Research engines ; it worked very well. But I will try it as is when the time comes for assembly. Perhaps some steam oil will work wonders !

Edited By Brian John on 24/03/2015 07:02:05
28 March 2015 at 12:25 #184704
Brian John
Participant
@brianjohn93961
Here are some photos of the wooden base…all 40 Euros of it ! When the top is fitted it does not quite cover up the slots. I have purchased some thin balsa wood from which I will cut thin strips to act as beading. I am hoping that this will cover up the defects. I am hoping that a light sanding will remove the ''burn'' marks and the darkened edges. I assume that this has been laser cut ?

Edited By Brian John on 28/03/2015 12:25:50
28 March 2015 at 12:42 #184705
pgk pgk
Participant
@pgkpgk17461
I'd wonder how much sanding would be needed to shift the burn marks.. almost worth using them as accent features perhaps with a dark stain? Other options might include iron-on veneers, just paint, being clever enough to paint woodgrain – a bit of a dark art using combs and rag-in any knotting or tile/brickwork all flat surfaces while sanding/staining in the edges to be varnished beading….
9 May 2015 at 16:55 #189215
Brian John
Participant
@brianjohn93961
I have just arrived back after 5 weeks in China. I am making a start on this kit. I will put it together to see how everything fits and see what rubs together before deciding what to paint and what not to paint.

I notice that this engine has two steam inlets which I have not seen before. Do I spilt the steam line into two using a T junction or something similar ?
9 May 2015 at 17:25 #189220
MichaelR
Participant
@michaelr
Brian.

I think the two ports are for the exhaust as your engine seems to have a piston valve, it may well have a centre steam connection for the inlet steam.

I will stand to be corrected on this.

Mike.
9 May 2015 at 17:40 #189223
JasonB
Moderator
@jasonb
Yes piston valve

In the instructions on page 3 the central connection has "zu dampf" or TO STEAM

How it works

J

PS did you manage to bring back a lathe in your hand luggage?

Edited By JasonB on 09/05/2015 17:48:19
10 May 2015 at 04:02 #189285
Brian John
Participant
@brianjohn93961
Thank you : the centre connection is the steam inlet. That makes things easier. I still do not like their Teflon coated piston. It does not look like it will last very long. A new piston and piston rings will be the order of the day when I get a lathe.

No, I did not bring back a lathe . I thought Melbourne Tool Shop would have new stock of the Sieg C0 by now but again they have been told by the supplier : ''end of next month'' . This has been going on for many months now ; it is very frustrating.

Edited By Brian John on 10/05/2015 04:06:31
13 May 2015 at 15:40 #189750
Brian John
Participant
@brianjohn93961
I always get a bit puzzled when it comes to deciding what parts to paint and what to leave as bare metal. If you look at the exploded diagram below it is the control box (it houses the steam valve) which is causing me problems.

I will leave the side which connects to the main cylinder (3) as bare metal.

1. What about the sides with the oval flanges for steam inlet and outlets ? Can I just paint the whole side (plugging up the screw holes before hand) and then screw the oval flanges over the top of these painted areas ?

2. What about the ends ? I could paint the whole end ( carefully masking off all the holes) then screw the cylinder covers over the painted area. I am not sure this is best practise. I could leave the ends bare metal and perhaps paint the cylinder covers instead ?

I am just after some opinions here.

3. The main cylinder (3) which houses the piston will have strips of wooden lagging glued to it. I intend to use JB WELD. What do most people use for glue in this instance ? Should I leave this area to be glued as bare metal ?

Edited By Brian John on 13/05/2015 15:41:45
13 May 2015 at 18:29 #189772
Neil Wyatt
Moderator
@neilwyatt
You can find almost any painting scheme on full size engines and many more on models…

I suggest looking at something like THIS website to get a few ideas.

Neil
13 May 2015 at 18:40 #189776
JasonB
Moderator
@jasonb
This is always an issue with "barstock" engines. On a full size one these parts would have been cast with raised areas where the mating glands and covers fit and only these smaller areas would have been machined so it is easy enough to just paint the as cast surfaces.

Myself I tend to mask mating surfaces rather than leave paint under them. You could do that by applying masking tape then hold the gland or cover in place and cut around with a scalple then remove the bits where you want the paint.

Holes can be kept clean by poking in bits of cocktail stick, golf tees etc

You may find the JB weld a bit too slow drying. If you can get a 5minute epoxy from the local DIY then mix that up in small batches and stick a few planks on at a time. The prefered way is to use wood glue to stick the strips to a thin cotton sheet and then they can be wrapped around the cylinder and retained with brass banding and a couple of screws.
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