Myford Change Wheels

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Myford Change Wheels

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  • #393978
    Chris Trice
    Participant
      @christrice43267

      I'd like to cut some change wheels for the ol' Super 7 but I was curious what the collective wisdom was about what material to use. I believe genuine Myford ones are iron but can I get away with Meehanite processed iron bar or do I need a harder grade?

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      #29885
      Chris Trice
      Participant
        @christrice43267
        #394011
        Andy Carruthers
        Participant
          @andycarruthers33275

          Same question for my WM180 – I'm sure I read aluminium change wheels are fine – cany anyone confirm please?

          #394021
          Nigel Bennett
          Participant
            @nigelbennett69913

            I've got some nylon ones off eBay for my Boxford 280; chap makes them for all sorts of lathes. Not had any problem. Change wheels aren't heavily loaded, so they're OK – like the OEM Myford Tufnol tumbler gears.

            #394022
            Roderick Jenkins
            Participant
              @roderickjenkins93242

              Pretty much anything will be probably outlast us but I chose FC steel for these " Myford" gears ( actually for the GHT bending rolls). They cut pretty easily with 2 passes of an RGD cutter.

              rolls gears.jpg

              Rod

              #394027
              Chris Trice
              Participant
                @christrice43267

                Nice work there Rod. OK, I'm sold. FC steel is the easiest option and should do what I want.

                #394032
                Andy Carruthers
                Participant
                  @andycarruthers33275

                  Lovely job Rod – only 2 passes?

                  I wonder how my chinesium cutters will do…

                  #394034
                  Chris Trice
                  Participant
                    @christrice43267

                    I was thinking that. 2 passes? I think I'm heading to the RDG website.

                    #394036
                    Hopper
                    Participant
                      @hopper

                      Steel gears may “ring” and run a bit noisier than cast iron, as can be heard on some Chinese lathes with steel gears.

                      #394038
                      Anonymous
                        Posted by Roderick Jenkins on 31/01/2019 21:02:40:

                        They cut pretty easily with 2 passes of an RGD cutter

                        Two passes? That's pussyfooting Rod! smile

                        When I started gear cutting I used a roughing and finish pass, but quickly realised it was a waste of time. It just wears the cutter. Use one pass and be done with it. Like this 6DP helical gear:

                        helical_gear_cutting_close_up.jpg

                        And it is an RDG cutter.

                        Andrew

                        #394040
                        Clive Hartland
                        Participant
                          @clivehartland94829

                          Alu. wheels will also make noise. But of course nobody will run gear wheels fast enough to make them noisy ?

                          Clive.

                          PS. I had an Opel Kapitan one time and the large timing gear was made of fibre which disintigrated. The replacement gear was aluminium and I could hear it when the engine was running.

                          #394046
                          Hopper
                          Participant
                            @hopper

                            Seems like Delrin (nylon-like plastic) has been a popular choice for change gear material in the past. Sure there have been threads on it before.

                            #394057
                            ega
                            Participant
                              @ega
                              Posted by Clive Hartland on 31/01/2019 22:34:38:
                              … I had an Opel Kapitan one time …

                              An uncle of mine had one of these some many years ago, two features of which I remember: the speedo was a horizontal ribbon which changed colour to reflect the speed limits and when you opened the driver's door a small spotlight illuminated the ignition, both useful in their own way.

                              Today's cars are keyless and tomorrow, no doubt, compliance with speed limits will be automatic.

                              #394059
                              Chris Trice
                              Participant
                                @christrice43267

                                Now that's showing off Andrew. Us mere mortals are more timid.

                                I think I'm going to machine a couple, one in steel and one in iron and try them out.

                                #394087
                                Andy Carruthers
                                Participant
                                  @andycarruthers33275

                                  Just read this in Gears and Gear Cutting – Ivan Law, p66

                                  "Always try to cut to the correct depth with one cut; nibbling away with a succession of small cuts is not recommended."

                                  I guess that answers the question for me, but I will not be attempting steel or iron with my first attempt – confidence is key!

                                  #394091
                                  Brian Wood
                                  Participant
                                    @brianwood45127

                                    Chris,

                                    All but the smaller Myford change wheels, from say 30T and less, are all usually supplied in cast iron. I have found that continuously cast material is excellent. The smaller sizes are made in steel to handle the tooth loading.

                                    Andrew is quite right and is not boasting, gears are cut in one pass. The cutters begin to lose their edge when not worked as intended and only need more frequent sharpening as a result.

                                    Regards

                                    Brian

                                    Edited By Brian Wood on 01/02/2019 09:01:08

                                    #394121
                                    Roderick Jenkins
                                    Participant
                                      @roderickjenkins93242

                                      Chaps,

                                      I accept the collective wisdom of the desirability of cutting the teeth in one pass but can somebody please explain to me the mechanism of more than one pass blunting the cutter?

                                      In my case a combination of the power of my mill motor and the slowest speed of my auto table traverse, not to mention the noise from the back gear, led me to be more comfortable with 2 passes and the cutter (which I assume is Chinesium) still seems to be sharp.

                                      Cheers,

                                      Rod

                                      #394128
                                      Chris Trice
                                      Participant
                                        @christrice43267

                                        Logic suggests that a tool that has x number of hours life span will take twice as long doing two passes as one achieving the same result in one pass. I think the description should read that it blunts the tool more prematurely than it needs to rather than the suggestion it blunts the tool beyond usability.

                                        #394131
                                        Chris Trice
                                        Participant
                                          @christrice43267

                                          …. and thanks for the info Brian.

                                          #394213
                                          Howard Lewis
                                          Participant
                                            @howardlewis46836

                                            At the risk of being accused of boasting, I followed Ivan Laws advice and cut the gears with one pass, but with a gentle feed in terms of feed per tooth.

                                            Most of us are unlikely to wear out a cutter with the number of times that we use it. If we were, it would probably be worth spending the money on an Industrial quality cutter for Industrial use.

                                            Myford gears, or all the ones that I have seen are cast iron. I have made up a couple of compound gears by cutting them in steel and sticking them together with an anaerobic.

                                            As pointed out elsewhere, be aware that Myford gears although 20DP are 14.5 degrees pressure angle, not 20.

                                            Howard

                                            #394225
                                            SillyOldDuffer
                                            Moderator
                                              @sillyoldduffer
                                              Posted by Roderick Jenkins on 01/02/2019 10:41:51:

                                              Chaps,

                                              I accept the collective wisdom of the desirability of cutting the teeth in one pass but can somebody please explain to me the mechanism of more than one pass blunting the cutter?

                                              If the tool is applied to cut in one pass, the whole cutting edge is applied to the work once only. Conversely, when the tool is applied in steps, the wear concentrates on the sharp end of the cutter. It's because, when nibbling, the sharp end does most of the work and goes blunt while the other end of the tool's edge is barely used at all.

                                              Provided the machine has enough grunt and the tool can take the strain, using the maximum amount of edge possible per cut will extend the life of the tool. This is important in industry, but even something the size of Bridgeport has limits, which is why hefty horizontal mills are popular.

                                              In practice, because my hobby mill flexes and the motor complains when pushed hard, I usually take more passes to remove metal than is ideal. Compared with the risk of damaging the machine or getting a poor finish the extra wear on the end of the cutters doesn't worry me much.

                                              Rubbing tools with very light cuts is to be avoided at all costs. As well as concentrating the wear, rubbing rather than cutting damages the edge rather quickly. Being over gentle with cutting tools is a good way of reducing their useful lives.

                                              Dave

                                              #394239
                                              not done it yet
                                              Participant
                                                @notdoneityet
                                                Posted by Roderick Jenkins on 31/01/2019 21:02:40:

                                                Pretty much anything will be probably outlast us but I chose FC steel for these " Myford" gears ( actually for the GHT bending rolls). They cut pretty easily with 2 passes of an RGD cutter.

                                                rolls gears.jpg

                                                Rod

                                                ‘They”. Do you mean you cut them all separately? Or was it one long cut and then parted off?

                                                #394243
                                                Roderick Jenkins
                                                Participant
                                                  @roderickjenkins93242
                                                  Posted by not done it yet on 01/02/2019 20:05:12:
                                                  Do you mean you cut them all separately? Or was it one long cut and then parted off?

                                                  rolls milling.jpg

                                                  smiley

                                                  Rod

                                                  #394268
                                                  Howard Lewis
                                                  Participant
                                                    @howardlewis46836

                                                    The same method as I used for my Bending Rolls.

                                                    You just chamfer the edges before finally parting off, and then make a collet to hold each gear while the faces are cleaned up, if they are not smooth enough.

                                                    Howard

                                                    #394276
                                                    not done it yet
                                                    Participant
                                                      @notdoneityet

                                                      Thanks for the pic, Rod.

                                                      I would have probably fitted 4 blanks on an arbor, to cut them.

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