Plastic for gears

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Plastic for gears

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  • #289167
    Alan Waddington 2
    Participant
      @alanwaddington2

      Would it be possible to use plastic for a lathe change gear, if so what is the best material to go for ? My old Harrison had a large fibre gear in the train, so I'm assuming there could be a suitable plastic type material that is machinable and readily available.

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      #29695
      Alan Waddington 2
      Participant
        @alanwaddington2
        #289169
        Nick_G
        Participant
          @nick_g

          .

          Delrin.??

          I posted this only yesterday. **LINK**

          Nick

          #289171
          Alan Waddington 2
          Participant
            @alanwaddington2

            Cheers Nick, I missed that post…..Delrin it is then

            #289173
            HOWARDT
            Participant
              @howardt

              We used to use tufnol on larger dp gears or nylatron on smaller ones.

              #289603
              BW
              Participant
                @bw

                I've succesfully used Delrin.

                #289608
                Clive Foster
                Participant
                  @clivefoster55965

                  Tufnol is excellent if you use the right grade in the correct grain orientation. Allegedly stronger and better able to cope with shock loads than delrin or nylon. But ideally needs proper attention to lubrication for long life. Delrin and nylon are, up to a point, happy run dry if kept clean.

                  Chocolate fireguard time if you use wrong grade and / or wrong grain orientation with Tufnol.

                  Clive.

                  #289611
                  MW
                  Participant
                    @mw27036
                    Posted by Clive Foster on 20/03/2017 10:41:58:

                    Chocolate fireguard time if you use wrong grade and / or wrong grain orientation with Tufnol.

                    Clive.

                    I take It this is with regards to sheet tufnol rather than the round bar?

                    Michael W

                    Edited By Michael-w on 20/03/2017 10:59:28

                    #289614
                    Russell Eberhardt
                    Participant
                      @russelleberhardt48058

                      Tufnol is surprisingly strong if the correct material is used (Woven sheet for gears, not rod which is rolled). I once had a vintage sports/racing car that used a Tufnol gear for the camshaft drive, admittedly the works racing team used a steel gear as they were not concerned with the noise but failures were very rare.

                      However these days I would use acetal (Delrin).

                      Russell.

                      #289619
                      HOWARDT
                      Participant
                        @howardt

                        we used sheet woven tufnol

                        #289834
                        Ian S C
                        Participant
                          @iansc

                          Tufnol gears are/were used to a great extent on printing presses, the ideal lubricant happened to be printing ink.

                          Ian S C

                          #289841
                          Muzzer
                          Participant
                            @muzzer

                            Nylon PA46 and PA66 are widely used for gears in demanding applications like high temperature automotive actuators. May be an option depending on availability.

                            #289842
                            John Stevenson 1
                            Participant
                              @johnstevenson1

                              One problem with the specialised plastics is locating them in small quantities at a reasonable price.

                              All plastics have rocketed up in price over the last few years. Tufnol used to be available for pence. I have seen works offices thrown up in a corner of the shop and sheeted in with tufnol sheet it was that cheap but now a piece of 1M x 300mm 10mm Whale Tufnol which is what is used for gears is over £100.

                              The cheaper grade is paper based and the dearer is fabric based.

                              I can only assume they are using £20 notes for the paper grade and Armani for the fabric grade.

                              #289845
                              Gordon Brown 1
                              Participant
                                @gordonbrown1

                                What would Tufnol rod be used for then, if not gears? I only ask as I was fortunate enough to pick up a fabric based rod for peanuts at a car boot sale and it's 76mm diameter by 512mm long, so fairly big. Been looking for use for it since I bought it!

                                #289848
                                Muzzer
                                Participant
                                  @muzzer

                                  Good for electrically insulating standoffs, knobs, handles and anything that doesn't need to be metallic. Rather like wood but without quite the same directional weakness. Machines nicely and polishes up with a bit of oil to show the colour textures. The phenolic smell isn't entirely pleasant but it's not particularly hazardous.

                                  Some ideas and data here.

                                  #289856
                                  Michael Gilligan
                                  Participant
                                    @michaelgilligan61133
                                    Posted by Gordon Brown 1 on 21/03/2017 13:05:37:

                                    What would Tufnol rod be used for then, if not gears?

                                    .

                                    Further to Muzzer's suggestions: Bearings

                                    MichaelG.

                                    #289858
                                    Neil Wyatt
                                    Moderator
                                      @neilwyatt
                                      Posted by Gordon Brown 1 on 21/03/2017 13:05:37:

                                      What would Tufnol rod be used for then, if not gears? I only ask as I was fortunate enough to pick up a fabric based rod for peanuts at a car boot sale and it's 76mm diameter by 512mm long, so fairly big. Been looking for use for it since I bought it!

                                      The rod is made by rolling up a sheet of paper or cloth in the resin, before hardening it. This means the layers are like the rings of a tree, so a gear will have the weak direction (between the layers) running across the teeth, making it easy to lose teeth. Gears made from flat sheets have the weak layers aligned so they only have to cope with forces trying to 'spilt' the gear – an unlikely situation in normal use.

                                      #289868
                                      Gordon Brown 1
                                      Participant
                                        @gordonbrown1

                                        Thanks for the replies guys, I had worked out the strength issue with making gears from rod, which is why it is still sitting on my shelf, sooner or later I'll be making something and realise that I can use it. Until then I suppose it will just have to lie there and stare at me! I did think of selling it but you know how it is, sell something like that and the following week it's just what you needed…

                                        #289870
                                        Jon Gibbs
                                        Participant
                                          @jongibbs59756

                                          I've not used them before but small quantities are available here…

                                          **LINK**

                                          HTH

                                          Jon

                                          #289880
                                          Gordon Brown 1
                                          Participant
                                            @gordonbrown1

                                            Strewth! That chunk of Tufnol sitting on my shelf would cost somewhere north of £200 to replace!

                                            #289927
                                            Kettrinboy
                                            Participant
                                              @kettrinboy

                                              I have several nylon gears in my Harrison L5 changegear set and when i needed one of them for cutting the thread in the backplate for a new chuck I was a bit worried if it would stand the load from cutting a 1.5 " X 6 TPI thread in cast iron but it did it fine , dont know if it would have done it if it had been a tufnol gear though , and a bonus is the geartrain runs a lot quieter with a plastic gear in it because as anybody with a Harrison knows the steel gears can ring a quite a bit at higher speeds.

                                              regards Geoff

                                              Edited By Kettrinboy on 21/03/2017 18:03:38

                                              #289932
                                              John Stevenson 1
                                              Participant
                                                @johnstevenson1

                                                Definitely would have done it and with some to spare.
                                                A 50T 16DP gear similar to a Harrison change wheel in nylon will handle 2.4Nm.

                                                The same gear in Tufnol will handle 3.76Nm.

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