Milling in lathe?

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Milling in lathe?

Home Forums Workshop Techniques Milling in lathe?

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  • #257036
    Perko7
    Participant
      @perko7

      Newbie question, in the absence of access to a milling machine, is it possible to mount a horizontal milling arbor between centres in a lathe, similar to a boring bar? I imagine it would only be suitable for light cuts, which is all i need.

      I think i've seen photos of this being done in early ME magazines.

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      #15875
      Perko7
      Participant
        @perko7
        #257039
        Hopper
        Participant
          @hopper

          Yes you certainly can. If you get a horizontal facing cutter it will work this way. But you will have a lot of fiddling about to raise the work up on packing pieces every time you want to take another cut.

          The more common way of milling in the lathe is to invest in a vertical slide that bolts on to the cross slide and holds the workpiece, or a small vice. Milling is then done by an endmill held in the lathe chuck.

          Yet another budget way around the problem is to make a fly cutter, basically a piece of square bar held in the four jaw chuck with a hole drilled in it to hold a lathe tool bit and a grub screw to hold the bit in place. Work is then clamped to the cross slide, or to an angle plate that is bolted to the cross slide and faced off using the makeshift cutter.

          There is a book in the Workshop Practice series called something like Milling in the Lathe that might be of more help to you.

          Don't forget too that if you just want to do flat facing work, the job is often best mounted on the face plate using clamps and or angle brackets (easily made from angle iron scraps) and turned in the conventional facing manner.

          #257042
          Thor 🇳🇴
          Participant
            @thor

            Hi Geoff,

            As Hopper says, yes you can. I have done it before I got a milling machine. Below are a few links that may give you some ideas what others have done:

            ***Link***

            ***Link***

            ***Link***

            ***Link***

            ***Link***

            Thor

            #257049
            Perko7
            Participant
              @perko7

              Thanks Hopper and Thor, I've seen most of those links already, but there a couple that are new to me so I'll have a look at them too.

              I have a vertical slide, but will need to buy an arbor and cutters to suit. I presume that the free end of the arbor, if it is running between centres, would be supported by a live centre in the tailstock, supplement if necessary with a fixed steady?

              Unfortunately the work needs to have a few thou shaved off a mating surface which has a raised edge, so i can't mount in the 4-jaw and face off in the usual way.

              Cheers.

              #257100
              Hopper
              Participant
                @hopper
                Posted by Geoff Perkins 1 on 21/09/2016 07:33:21:

                I have a vertical slide, but will need to buy an arbor and cutters to suit. I presume that the free end of the arbor, if it is running between centres, would be supported by a live centre in the tailstock, supplement if necessary with a fixed steady?

                Unfortunately the work needs to have a few thou shaved off a mating surface which has a raised edge, so i can't mount in the 4-jaw and face off in the usual way.

                Cheers.

                Sounds like you could just use an end milling cutter held in the 3-jaw chuck if you have a vertical slide? Or is it something special?

                Yes, arbor is supported at the far end by either rotating or dead centre if you go that route. Fixed steady would only be needed if your arbor is too long, or taking very heavy cuts etc.

                #257121
                Neil Wyatt
                Moderator
                  @neilwyatt

                  The drummond round bed was particularly good at this. You could angle the cross-slide by rotating the saddle around the bed to achieve different depths of cut.

                  Neil

                  #257228
                  Nick Hulme
                  Participant
                    @nickhulme30114

                    Many lathes are set up to face slightly concave, this was an issue with my initial foray into milling on a lathe,

                    – Nick

                    #257251
                    not done it yet
                    Participant
                      @notdoneityet

                      Nick,

                      Is this a function of cutting load as the tool moves across the face, or maybe the cross slide being deflected more the further away from the central position? Maybe 'spring' cuts are required for many more facing operations than most think?

                      #257259
                      david williams 14
                      Participant
                        @davidwilliams14

                        excellent links thor. added to my favorites list. almost time to add a few sub-folders, so I can better find things. perhaps also time to delete a few I don't use

                        #257273
                        Michael Gilligan
                        Participant
                          @michaelgilligan61133
                          Posted by Nick Hulme on 21/09/2016 23:51:48:

                          Many lathes are set up to face slightly concave …

                          .

                          Dr. Schlesinger would be turning in his grave, if he knew that his ideals are so abused by "many" manufacturers and/or misunderstood by "many" users.

                          Schlesinger's concept of 'slightly concave' differed greatly from that applied to your "Many lathes", Nick.

                          What he specified represents 'flat, to slightly concave' [i.e. just sufficient to ensure 'not convex']

                          I will leave you to find the numbers: But if the lathe is set to turn sufficiently concave that it presents a real problem with milling … There is something seriously wrong with [or, for the Politically Correct, 'special about'] the lathe.

                          MichaelG.

                          #257281
                          Ian S C
                          Participant
                            @iansc

                            In issue 21 of MEW there was apull out plan for a "Lathe Milling Attachment" by J. Neave. this is mounted between the head and tail stock, and has a gear driven milling shaft, hight adjustable by pivoting the attachment. It is designed to fit a lathe 3 1/2" center height and above, an interesting tool.

                            Ian S C

                            #257293
                            JasonB
                            Moderator
                              @jasonb

                              I do believe that even the Myford is set to turn slightly concave and that has not stopped thousands of users making use of it for milling. As michael says it is so slight most of us would have a job measuring it.

                              #257296
                              Anonymous

                                The accuracy specification for my Harrison M300 gives a maximum deviation of 0.02/300 (millimetres) concave. Probably rather better than the tram on many mills.

                                Andrew

                                #257313
                                JA
                                Participant
                                  @ja

                                  Horizontal milling in a lathe – My worry would be the support of the arbor provided by the tailstock. Anything but the lightest cut would concern me and as for climb milling………..

                                  I have happily used a cutter held in a three jaw chuck with the work on a vertical slide on many occasions. I do try to remember to check if the cutter is coming loose though. A better option would be to use a proper holder and draw bar but I have yet to make the draw bar.

                                  I do not understand why the miniscule concavity should be an issue.

                                  JA

                                  #257314
                                  Anonymous
                                    Posted by JA on 22/09/2016 11:57:47:

                                    I do not understand why the miniscule concavity should be an issue.

                                    It isn't; just more willy waving.

                                    Andrew

                                    #257459
                                    Perko7
                                    Participant
                                      @perko7

                                      Thanks for all the responses, both the helpful and the off-track smiley.

                                      After considering the options, and the actual amount of metal to be removed, i decided it wasn't worth the hassle and chose to use the opportunity to improve my hand filing skills. Three hours work resulting in six axleboxes now sliding freely but snugly in the horns with minimal play.

                                      #257468
                                      Ian S C
                                      Participant
                                        @iansc

                                        The arm strong milling machine (file) is often quicker on small jobs.

                                        Ian S C

                                        #257801
                                        Nick Hulme
                                        Participant
                                          @nickhulme30114
                                          Posted by Michael Gilligan on 22/09/2016 09:28:16:

                                          Posted by Nick Hulme on 21/09/2016 23:51:48:

                                          Many lathes are set up to face slightly concave …

                                          .

                                          I will leave you to find the numbers: But if the lathe is set to turn sufficiently concave that it presents a real problem with milling … There is something seriously wrong with [or, for the Politically Correct, 'special about'] the lathe.

                                          MichaelG.

                                          Michael,

                                          I'm fully aware that the concavity is tiny, and I know why this was done, but this still equates to out of tram, the beauty of a mill is that you can tram it for visually perfect results where the paths of large cutters overlap, I assume from your attitude to this feature that you're also relaxed about tramming your mill

                                          Nick

                                          #257804
                                          Michael Gilligan
                                          Participant
                                            @michaelgilligan61133

                                            Posted by Nick Hulme on 25/09/2016 12:11:40:

                                            Michael,

                                            I'm fully aware that the concavity is tiny, and I know why this was done, but this still equates to out of tram, the beauty of a mill is that you can tram it for visually perfect results where the paths of large cutters overlap, I assume from your attitude to this feature that you're also relaxed about tramming your mill

                                            Nick

                                            .

                                            Nick,

                                            My 'mill' is a BCA Mk.III and is [to within my measurement capability] perfectly aligned when I insert the dowel.

                                            There is no need, or facility, to 'tram' it.

                                            MichaelG.

                                            #257817
                                            JA
                                            Participant
                                              @ja

                                              Thanks to this thread I have learnt a new word:

                                              "tram, vb, trams, tamming, trammed, to adjust (a mechanism) to a fine degree of accuracy" Collins English Dictionary.

                                              JA

                                              #257818
                                              Michael Gilligan
                                              Participant
                                                @michaelgilligan61133
                                                Posted by JA on 25/09/2016 13:59:20:

                                                Thanks to this thread I have learnt a new word:

                                                .

                                                Its origin is in trammel

                                                MichaelG.

                                                #258270
                                                Nick Hulme
                                                Participant
                                                  @nickhulme30114

                                                  I'm surprised no-one has pointed out that lathes were not designed for milling and produced a signed scroll from the original designer stating this and assuming this constitutes proof it can't be done

                                                  #258273
                                                  Michael Gilligan
                                                  Participant
                                                    @michaelgilligan61133
                                                    Posted by Nick Hulme on 28/09/2016 09:03:21:

                                                    I'm surprised no-one has pointed out that lathes were not designed for milling and produced a signed scroll from the original designer stating this and assuming this constitutes proof it can't be done

                                                    .

                                                    And I'm surprised that you are forever taunting, instead of contributing anything useful to the discussion.

                                                    … The word "Troll" might be appropriate.

                                                    MichaelG.

                                                    Edited By Michael Gilligan on 28/09/2016 09:21:23

                                                    #258433
                                                    Ian S C
                                                    Participant
                                                      @iansc

                                                      The lathe, specially in the model engineers workshop has been, and still is considered a universal tool, and if you can work out how to do a job on it, what ever it is, then that's OK. Aside from turning, it can be used as a mill, or used as a shaper/planer for cutting key ways,and I suppose you can cut gears the same way.

                                                      Ian S C

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