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Viewing 25 posts - 1 through 25 (of 36 total)
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  • #523761
    Nick Welburn
    Participant
      @nickwelburn

      I’ve got a 4 jaw Chuck 100mm Chuck I bought on eBay for my amadeal cj18 lathe.

      I tried to fit it up this afternoon for the next stage of my 10v. It’s the same size as the 3 jaw but the internal centre bore is different?
      we are talking circa 69mm in the 4 jaw and 72/73 mm in the 3 jaw.

      is there a different standard? Would the men of this forum just have mounted it up and made it 72mm?

      yours confused but happy of the garage.

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      #10670
      Nick Welburn
      Participant
        @nickwelburn

        Why doesn’t my 4jaw Chuck fit?

        #523764
        JasonB
        Moderator
          @jasonb

          This man would have measured his lathe first and bought a chuck to fit. Most minilathes seem to be 72mm now but some can vary.

          Either send it back and get a 72mm recess one or make a backplate for it or as a last resort bore out the back of the chuck but check bolt PCD

          Edited By JasonB on 30/01/2021 19:06:20

          #523766
          old mart
          Participant
            @oldmart

            You could bore out the rear of the new chuck, but you might find the mounting holes are in different positions.

            #523774
            Stuart Smith 5
            Participant
              @stuartsmith5

              I have a CJ18A mini lathe from Amadeal. I bought a 4 jaw chuck from Amadeal at the same time as the lathe.

              I have measured the recess and it is 72 mm with a PCD of 84 mm. The 4 fixings are M8 tapped holes in the chuck.

              There was a previous post about the a chuck for a Warco mini lathe.**LINK**

              This page from Warco shows the dimensions of their chucks. It looks like the item 8044 is the same size as the Amadeal Cj18a. **LINK** but they list an item number 4902 for their mini lathe.

              Probably easiest to return yours if possible and buy one to this spec with 72 mm register and 84 pcd.

              Stuart

              Edited By Stuart Smith 5 on 30/01/2021 19:26:13

              Edited By Stuart Smith 5 on 30/01/2021 19:29:18

              #523784
              Nick Welburn
              Participant
                @nickwelburn

                Hmm. Ok it seems mine is 70mm centre bore and an 84mm PCD.

                stupidly as Amadeal was out of stock I bought from EBay and the advert only mentions 100mm and no centre bore / pcd details.

                ive just attached the Chuck to the spindle backwards using the jaws. I’ll need to find some slightly longer cap head Allen bolts. But it feels like a goer.

                #523785
                old mart
                Participant
                  @oldmart

                  _igp2582.jpg_igp2581.jpgI have one of the 7 X 12 Warco lathes at home and treated it to a new 80mm three jaw and a 100mm independent. The 80 just fitted on and is much better than the original one. The four jaw had rear mounting holes and was easily modified by boring the register and adding front mounting holes at the same pcd as the original. I had the advantage of a bigger lathe for the boring, but it could be done well enough just using the three jaw chuck with a piece of 30mm bar, skimmed true and then mounting the four jaw on the bar and doing the boring. The holes are reasonably easy. This would not work with a four jaw scroll chuck.

                   

                  _igp2580.jpg

                  Edited By old mart on 30/01/2021 20:52:08

                  #523787
                  Tony Wright 1
                  Participant
                    @tonywright1

                    Excellent

                    #523943
                    Stuart Smith 5
                    Participant
                      @stuartsmith5

                      My chuck uses threaded studs and nuts, not bolts. (The threaded holes in the chuck don’t go through.).

                      Is the one you have bought like that?

                      Stuart

                      #523972
                      old mart
                      Participant
                        @oldmart

                        I can't remember why I decided to go for front mount through bolts, tapped holes on the same pcd at the rear with studs would have worked just as well.

                        #523994
                        Nick Welburn
                        Participant
                          @nickwelburn
                          Posted by Stuart Smith 5 on 31/01/2021 15:40:23:

                          My chuck uses threaded studs and nuts, not bolts. (The threaded holes in the chuck don’t go through.).

                          Is the one you have bought like that?

                          Stuart

                          My 3 jaw is help on with m8 nuts and threaded studs.
                          The 4 jaw has m6 bolts.

                          I’m pretty confident I can bore it out 1mm and it’ll bolt up. Basically as I see it the absolute location is not paramount (it’s a 4 jaw) but it needs to sit well on the spindle.

                          #523995
                          Nick Welburn
                          Participant
                            @nickwelburn

                            The spindle itself is not threaded. It has m8 clear holes.

                            #524000
                            not done it yet
                            Participant
                              @notdoneityet

                              Basically as I see it the absolute location is not paramount (it’s a 4 jaw) but it needs to sit well on the spindle.

                              Do you want to risk an unbalanced chuck revolving at 2000rpm? I wouldn’t.

                              Edited By not done it yet on 31/01/2021 18:47:48

                              #524005
                              Anonymous
                                Posted by old mart on 31/01/2021 17:27:29:

                                I can't remember why I decided to go for front mount through bolts, tapped holes on the same pcd at the rear with studs would have worked just as well.

                                I remember, back in the days of yore when I had an early minilathe, the chuck was fitted with studs at the rear. The clearance for getting the nuts on was minimal – about the height of a low profile nut – and a major PITA.

                                Perhaps similar considerations made you use front through mount bolts?

                                #524009
                                Ron Laden
                                Participant
                                  @ronladen17547

                                  My CJ18 came with a 100mm 3 jaw which had M8 threaded holes and a 72mm recess, when I ordered a 100mm 4 jaw from ARC that to came with the 72mm recess and that also had the M8 holes. I fitted both of them with M8 grub screws of suitable length, I used Loctite to keep them in position and maintain the correct amount of protrusion for the flange and nut, it worked well.

                                  #524017
                                  old mart
                                  Participant
                                    @oldmart

                                    Peter, I certainly allowed a generous ammount of clearance for the bolts in the front mount, but probably didn't think at the time of fixed studs being hard to mount. It was probably because I had earlier mounted the new 6" lightweight Toolmex chuck on the backplate that the scrapped off PB had been screwed to using front mounting. That was for the Smart & Brown model A.

                                    If you look closely at the pictures I posted, you will notice the plain ends of the studs which helps get the nuts started. Those nuts with built in washers are 12.9  6mm, as are the SHCS.

                                    Edited By old mart on 31/01/2021 19:51:11

                                    Edited By old mart on 31/01/2021 19:52:03

                                    #524018
                                    Nick Welburn
                                    Participant
                                      @nickwelburn
                                      Posted by not done it yet on 31/01/2021 18:47:24:

                                      Basically as I see it the absolute location is not paramount (it’s a 4 jaw) but it needs to sit well on the spindle.

                                      Do you want to risk an unbalanced chuck revolving at 2000rpm? I wouldn’t.

                                      Edited By not done it yet on 31/01/2021 18:47:48

                                      I’m maybe not understanding how this locates then. By understanding is that the prime location of the Chuck is on the centre bore. Assuming I can achieve the bore from 70mm to 72mm then it should sit as per the 3 jaw.
                                      The bolts are then to hold it in place as opposed to locating it? Ergo the Chuck should be stable?

                                      my thinking is that whatever I have mounted to it (which would be by definition unbalanced as it has a no circular bit of stock in it)

                                      Does my logic make sense? Or are the bolts doing the locating and the bore just helps the initial location? In which case my m6 bolts in m8 clear holes will be an issue.

                                      #524019
                                      Nick Welburn
                                      Participant
                                        @nickwelburn

                                        Perhaps better would be to make some unthreaded m8 shanks with a m6 clear hole that the m6’s can go into.

                                        #524020
                                        old mart
                                        Participant
                                          @oldmart

                                          The fit of the register should be a light push or no more than 0.003" , 0.075mm clearance. 4 jaw independents are often loaded with very offset work, and the speed will have to be reduced as the out of balance forces increase.

                                          The bolts hold the chuck on the spindle and the register makes sure the body of the chuck runs reasonably true.

                                          Edited By old mart on 31/01/2021 20:01:45

                                          #524033
                                          Nick Wheeler
                                          Participant
                                            @nickwheeler
                                            Posted by old mart on 31/01/2021 17:27:29:

                                            I can't remember why I decided to go for front mount through bolts, tapped holes on the same pcd at the rear with studs would have worked just as well.

                                            Front mount through bolts are considerably easier to mount to a new backing plate:

                                            Turn the register so you're happy with the chuck fit.

                                            Clamp the two together somehow

                                            Mark through the chuck mounting holes

                                            Drill and tap

                                            Bolt the two together.

                                             

                                            Minimal measuring and awkward marking out required.

                                             

                                            Bolts should never be used to locate anything, although we all do it. Dowels, pins or machined faces(the register on a chuck backplate for instance) are required for precise location.

                                            Edited By Nicholas Wheeler 1 on 31/01/2021 20:53:58

                                            #524038
                                            Nick Welburn
                                            Participant
                                              @nickwelburn

                                              Cool. I’ve already got the holes in the spindle and chuck just needs a mount up for the cut of the register

                                              #524095
                                              Howard Lewis
                                              Participant
                                                @howardlewis46836

                                                For anyone tired of dropping, and then having find, the nuts that hold a chuck to the flange, Danny M2Z had an article in MEW showing his simple "Widget" to hold the nuts for fitting or removal. This was intended for mini lathes with M6 studs and nuts.

                                                It works extremely well, and could easily be scaled to suit larger nuts.

                                                Howard

                                                #524102
                                                Nick Wheeler
                                                Participant
                                                  @nickwheeler
                                                  Posted by Howard Lewis on 01/02/2021 12:12:41:

                                                  For anyone tired of dropping, and then having find, the nuts that hold a chuck to the flange, Danny M2Z had an article in MEW showing his simple "Widget" to hold the nuts for fitting or removal. This was intended for mini lathes with M6 studs and nuts.

                                                  It works extremely well, and could easily be scaled to suit larger nuts.

                                                  So does a strip of masking tape on the back edge of a spanner.

                                                  If you do that a lot, one of THESE clipped onto the spanner is good.

                                                  #524181
                                                  not done it yet
                                                  Participant
                                                    @notdoneityet

                                                    Dunno about that particular machine but my recollection was that there was one small place where the nut/bolts were more easily held/screwed. Does that apply to the machine in question?

                                                    #524184
                                                    Howard Lewis
                                                    Participant
                                                      @howardlewis46836

                                                      There is not much room for fingers behind the chuck on a mini lathe. Plenty enough for a nut to fall though!

                                                      I sealed the studs into my chucks and made up the DannyM2Z "Widget" which does just what is required to hold the nut while you start each nut on, or remove from, the thread.

                                                      It is only a bit of steel strapping with two sheared cuts, and the centre "tongue" bent to locate in the nut.

                                                      Time making it was well spent.

                                                      Howard.

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